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Post by worcesterfan2018 on Nov 25, 2018 9:49:55 GMT
Brilliant opening line from worcesterfan2018, “1st things first I’m not going to start arguing with people on here”, followed by arguing with people on here.....😀 DTL returns? Wasn’t arguing just expressing my opinion! Am I not allowed to do that without arguing then? IMO Baldwin is not good enough and he is not the only one either Evans , Bates, and some others are just poor players at this level! |
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Post by Mark on Nov 25, 2018 12:20:01 GMT
I’ve not been one to call for the Manger to be sacked following a poor result in the past but I really do think John Snape is not up to the job. He brought the players in, he set the tactics and he picked the team.
I know we have little money but I really do think we would do better spending what we can afford on the best manager we can get in and see what he can get out of the players we have. We seem to be signing new players every other week and still put in a shocking display like yesterday
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Post by The sound and the fury on Nov 25, 2018 12:31:28 GMT
I've kept out of it so far, preferring to let it sink in. Yesterday needed to happen, to shake a few people up. We've been very fortunate this season on a number of occasions, but yesterday was the first time we've really met anyone clinical enough to capitalise consistently.
Injuries to Smith and English, coupled with the long-term loss of Gallinagh meant we had little choice on the full back selection. Personally I might have gone Caines at left back and Keasey at right back, but I'm not the manager. I don't like this 4-5-1/4-3-3 formation, we don't have the discipline or quality to play it effectively, and too often the midfield totally loses shape, leading Stods and Foz to have to go longer. We're basically conceding midfield, and teams have sussed this. No doubt that Balders is an attacking threat, but he's also our biggest weakness. I don't think he's got a brain at all, certainly not a football one. The pre-Desborough disgrace notwithstanding, how many times is he going to play that blind infield ball until he gets the message? Westfields couldn't believe their luck only a minute in yesterday, they're hard enough to beat without gifting them a head start. Balders reminds me of the street footballing kid who can dribble round everyone but has no concept of other players on the park. Too much of a loose cannon for me, use him as an impact sub or move him on. I don't know what's going on with Stods at the moment, he's been shocking for weeks. Playing like he's on something, slow, ponderous, indecisive, risky, every choice is a wrong one, seems to always want an extra touch instead of doing what he is supposed to and clearing the ball. He's a liability at present, not a captain colossus. Foz is wasted at centre half, and since he's gone back there we've lost the composure he brings in midfield. Withington and Caines are like peas in a pod, they'll run all day but when the ball is at their feet you know it's going to go wrong, not an ounce of technical quality between them. I've lost track of the amount of times Withington misreads the midfield scene and gets too far ahead of the play, leaving a hole that is too easy for the opponents to exploit. I suspect Birlo's injury is really impacting him as he's stopped his trademark bursts forward with the ball and we don't have anyone around him who is capable of getting on his passing wavelength.
Jezeph has earned us lots of points this season and picked up a fair few plaudits along the way, but he let everyone down yesterday. First goal he was slow to react and then came too far, no way should Molineux have even been able to get the shot away but Jezeph showed why he's a Midland League keeper despite what his ego might tell him. Not much he could do about the rest, but you cannot throw your toys out the prom and confront the ref and expect to get away with it. Idiotic in the extreme, it actually came across like a spoilt brat who wanted to take his ball home because it wasn't going the way he thought it should be, like he deliberately got sent off so he wouldn't have to pick any more out the net.
So what do we do about it? Personally I think it's time for a couple of changes. Snape doesn't seem to be able to influence anything, so he'd be first out the door. We desperately need a decisive and talismanic centre half, and a centre midfielder who can impose himself on proceedings. The only thing lacking besides that is confidence, there's plenty of goal capability and a good sprinkling of quality. Players like Liam Lockett and the impressive Mason Birch are the future, we need to endure a strong on-pitch platform to allow them to play with exuberance and confidence.
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dragon
First Teamer
Posts: 355
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Post by dragon on Nov 25, 2018 12:32:59 GMT
Not the worst ever result by a very long way. 60 odd years ago, I watched a City Reserves side lose 0-13 at Brierley Hill on a Boxing Day. It was rumoured that our Welsh International goalkeeper, Ioworth Hughes, was `the worse for wear` ! Crazy to think that the `stiffs`- playing in the Birmingham League- were then competing at a much higher level than the sorry lot who bear the Club`s name nowadays !
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Post by jupu on Nov 25, 2018 13:57:38 GMT
Nice memories there dragon!
Yesterday has been appropriate described as "Black Saturday" by one City fan on Facebook. I think that's entirely appropriate and henceforth the game should always be referred to as such!
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Post by bornandbred on Nov 25, 2018 15:09:25 GMT
Utterly abysmal yesterday. The last month or so has been bad, but never have I seen anything quite like that before.
The biggest problem is that the pitches are changing and the team/game plan isn't. Forget who's out injured etc, we are missing somebody up top who can hold onto the ball (Evans surely the best option?), a battling centre mid (Caines/Withington are not the answer) and a different idea to trying to pass the ball into the net.
Far too often yesterday we were bypassing the midfield and smashing balls to the forwards who couldn't hold the thing. If we had somebody up there who could look after it and bring in the wide players it would be so much more effective than this 'hit and hope' stuff. Go back to basics and just play through the thirds properly.
As for our defending, I don't even know how to describe that. Take absolutely nothing away from Westfields, but they weren't particularly good, we just gifted them every single goal (some, like the fifth, without any hassle at all).
As it's been said, yesterday is hopefully a wake up call. Players need changing soon or the management do. Can be accused of being short sighted and forgetting the unbeaten run, but the pitches/games are totally different now so we need to adapt as such.
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Post by zeke on Nov 25, 2018 15:33:35 GMT
With only 2 home games in the next 7 weeks and none at Xmas/New Year, this result and no improvement could see the end of the season for many fans.
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Post by jupu on Nov 25, 2018 15:49:17 GMT
That's a bit of a sweeping statement. It's pure speculation. Have you given up on supporting City this season?
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leon
Squad Member
Posts: 253
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Post by leon on Nov 25, 2018 16:05:13 GMT
Next up is Bromsgrove Sporting whilst the pessimism abounds
What bugs me a bit is that I am unsure of what we are looking for in player recruitment? I ask as a contributor to Team builder. We have a successful youth team to use for the development of young players so do we need other clubs'?
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stamoo
First Teamer
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Post by stamoo on Nov 25, 2018 18:11:39 GMT
“No doubt that Balders is an attacking threat, but he's also our biggest weakness. I don't think he's got a brain at all, certainly not a football one. The pre-Desborough disgrace notwithstanding, how many times is he going to play that blind infield ball until he gets the message? Westfields couldn't believe their luck only a minute in yesterday, they're hard enough to beat without gifting them a head start.”
Teej, not wishing to appear pedantic but it was Dave Reynolds, with his first touch of the ball, who played that awful ‘blind’ infield back pass that gifted Westfield their first goal, not Baldwin. In the end it mattered little but it certainly didn’t help!!!!!
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Post by auldreekie on Nov 25, 2018 19:49:24 GMT
Not the worst ever result by a very long way. 60 odd years ago, I watched a City Reserves side lose 0-13 at Brierley Hill on a Boxing Day. It was rumoured that our Welsh International goalkeeper, Ioworth Hughes, was `the worse for wear` ! Crazy to think that the `stiffs`- playing in the Birmingham League- were then competing at a much higher level than the sorry lot who bear the Club`s name nowadays ! Great memory Dragon! I could not help but look the game up. The Birmingham League game was actually played on Christmas Day morning 1952 at Brierley Hill and as you say the score was Brierley Hill 13 Worcester City 0. On Boxing Day City reserves were away to Boldmere St Michaels and lost 0:2. Brierley Hill were in rich goal-scoring form and a 5:2 win over Cradley Heath on Boxing Day meant that they had scored 33 goals in four matches. Although Brierley Hill only finished in third place they scored 20 more goals than any other club thanks largely to a 13-goal Christmas present. The consolation was the City first team beat Kidderminster Harriers home and away on Christmas Day and Boxing Day respectively. JuPu’s spot on with his comment about yesterday when he said: “ It's easy to dismiss today as a bad day at the office, but is it as simple as that? I made the comment here recently that if the focus is on regrouping, learning lessons and moving on after a defeat then there's not much evidence of this. Today's result only underlines my point.” The team I watch up here had a 7:0 drubbing earlier in the season with a former player scoring a hat-trick! At the end of the game the players sat in the centre circle by themselves for a long time discussing the match. There was no shouting or finger pointing but the players themselves decided they needed to do something and they were going to do it now for as long as it took. Who knows what was said other than the players but it worked and the team won its next four matches without conceding a goal. Sometimes it is up to players to sort things out between themselves. |
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Post by jupu on Nov 25, 2018 20:00:40 GMT
It's a good point - if yesterday hurt the players as much as the fans, they should be sufficiently motivated to want to sort it out for themselves. It's evident there is still much passion for our club, I hope they realise it.
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Post by zeke on Nov 25, 2018 21:09:45 GMT
That's a bit of a sweeping statement. It's pure speculation. Have you given up on supporting City this season? Only the second time in almost 40 years I've left half way through the second half. I personally haven't given up but there were lots of peeved people. A few more of these performances and I don't see many 300 gates. |
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Post by Tim Munslow on Nov 25, 2018 23:06:45 GMT
I didn't see anyone on here giving Westfields much credit: they looked a good team to me, without any outstanding individual players, but playing as a TEAM!
I would back them over Ilkeston any day. I too left early and so missed our one goal.
That performance (well, lack of) will impact on the gates for a long time to come, especially with winter coming.
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Post by The sound and the fury on Nov 25, 2018 23:36:06 GMT
“No doubt that Balders is an attacking threat, but he's also our biggest weakness. I don't think he's got a brain at all, certainly not a football one. The pre-Desborough disgrace notwithstanding, how many times is he going to play that blind infield ball until he gets the message? Westfields couldn't believe their luck only a minute in yesterday, they're hard enough to beat without gifting them a head start.” Teej, not wishing to appear pedantic but it was Dave Reynolds, with his first touch of the ball, who played that awful ‘blind’ infield back pass that gifted Westfield their first goal, not Baldwin. In the end it mattered little but it certainly didn’t help!!!!! It was indeed Reyno for that one, but Balders does it all the time, just tucks the ball inside to where he assumes someone should be, always without looking and without any regard for his team. Sums him up perfectly, he doesn't give a toss. First out the door for me, his attitude stinks. |
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Post by martwc on Nov 26, 2018 1:37:03 GMT
Well after working a night shift there’s nothing like reading the good old forum on a Sunday but after yesterday’s display I can’t help but join in, I told myself I wouldn’t as would never want to slag off a player who commits a lot of there time for very little money (I’m told) and would never intentionally go out there to make a mistake and not try. I think a lot of us lose the thought that we are a midland premier league side with a mid table budget now with teams like Khalsa, wood, westfields, Ilkeston, Highgate paying considerably more. That being said Mr. Snape has to take a lot of responsibility here.
The team selection... Birley right back against there best player poor Matt a great servant but he’s finished unfortunately. Molyneux is a player I have admired for years and I find it astonishing how ignorant we was to the fact that it was always going to be a mismatch. Caines and whitington can’t pass a ball they we’re atrocious yesterday leaving poor Stoddart exposed. A player who I hate to knock as he seems to love the club and try his hardest ever week but is simply out of his depth and unfortunately Snape consistently plays him after such poor performances due to him being captain. Their manager consistently shouted to his players to play on him and with little protection anyway he was always going to have a bad day.
As for the rest not much to say, I thought Birch looked assured when he came on and Evans worked his nuts off and deserved his goal in what was just a non contest second half.
Now the question begs what next? I believe Jezeph will now go back after his cowardly act, I can see Baldwin leaving after being dragged early once again, will reyno want to stay after that? Harrison looks a shadow of his early form and low on confidence maybe clubs are sniffing him or the early season talk about him has gone to his head. I fear Forsythe will leave it wouldn’t surprise me the only player who never hides, consistently plays well and shows quality and composure on the ball above this level but Snape insist on playing him at the back where he sometimes tries to be too clever and overplays with bad players around him. That leaves no one to create higher up on the pitch and provide any service for the starved frontline of Baldwin and Harrison.
Change is needed and quickly...
That being said, can’t wait for the 4th Dec #utc
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Post by cloud on Nov 26, 2018 9:42:08 GMT
Are we at the lowest point in our history? Probably. (So far).
Nobody knows about other club’s budgets. There’s no budget league table, everyone just guesses.
Westfields was probably our most attractive remaining league game left of the season. With only 10 home league games left (over 22 weeks), we will need as many people to attend games as possible, otherwise cashflow/income is bound to be a problem. With this in mind, the club needs to release some good news, fast, anything really, to start the positivity/rebuilding process. Any Perdiswell progress news that could be released?
BTW- I don’t think Reyno is back, he played because Redditch didn’t have a game.
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harley
Squad Member
Posts: 243
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Post by harley on Nov 26, 2018 14:26:34 GMT
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Post by Tim Munslow on Nov 26, 2018 20:22:36 GMT
martwc says "That being said, can’t wait for the 4th Dec #utc": what's happening on 4th December?
Indicentally, with all this talk of high scoring home defeats did I dream this, but I have a vague recollection of us playing Boston when they were going great guns in the Midland League (now defunct), in a floodlit friendly and we lost 7-1? I think it was in the early 70's, but perhaps Julian would have a record of it? The result is not in the official history.
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Post by The sound and the fury on Nov 26, 2018 20:28:02 GMT
martwc says "That being said, can’t wait for the 4th Dec #utc": what's happening on 4th December? "Home" to Bromsgrove in the Worcs Senior Urn |
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Post by jupu on Nov 27, 2018 7:53:12 GMT
martwc says "That being said, can’t wait for the 4th Dec #utc": what's happening on 4th December? Indicentally, with all this talk of high scoring home defeats did I dream this, but I have a vague recollection of us playing Boston when they were going great guns in the Midland League (now defunct), in a floodlit friendly and we lost 7-1? I think it was in the early 70's, but perhaps Julian would have a record of it? The result is not in the official history. Tim - well done on spotting that. On 12 October 1959 we lost 1-7 at home to Peterborough United - not Boston - in a Midland Floodlit Cup match. I had completely overlooked that one, as it was always a minor competition, although it did attract big crowds and forms part of our first team records. So, Saturday was our worst home defeat in 59 years, but nevertheless our worst home league defeat since 1946. Incidentally Peterborough were elected to the Football League at the end of the season, having won the Midland League 5 years in succession, and the following year they won what was then called Division 4 as well. |
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Post by Tim Munslow on Nov 27, 2018 19:46:56 GMT
Ah - it was Peterborough then: in my memory it was Boston - from the same neck of the woods anyway. I seem to remember the match being thought of at the time as a sort of challenge between the Midland League and the Southern League to see who was the better. I do remember them absolutely dominating the old Midland League for years on end.
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Post by highbury on Nov 28, 2018 20:36:53 GMT
This was the first home game I've missed a home game for some time - I feel like I dodged a bullet.
The last time I recall similar circumstances was against Newport. 4-0 down at half time at home with Shab sent off. We won the second half 1-0 though! The difference being that Newport were a very good side then and won the league at a canter if I recall. I also think Shab got sent off in the away match due to his constant run in with their winger who he seemed to take a deep dislike to.
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Post by jupu on Nov 29, 2018 8:43:02 GMT
The 5-3 defeat at home to Khalsa last season had a similar feeling for me, it was that game that convinced me we weren't good enough to win promotion. To be fair I haven't had any expectation that we might be in with a shout of lifting the MFL title this season, but last Saturday showed just how far off we are. To be honest the Vase defeat was much more of a disappointment as a run in that competition would have generated both income and extra support.
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Post by alwaysnextyear on Nov 29, 2018 12:31:37 GMT
highbury - you don't realise how lucky you were !
If we continue with our self imploding tactics on wintry pitches, we'll be lucky to make the top half of the table ! Wrong formation and tactics for weeks, far too many passes sideways in both halves, ponderous in possession, not enough players in the final third, no close support to the striker, no one in the front six who can head a ball, no midfielder running past the striker, taking too long to get forward after winning the ball in midfield, no physical presence in the front six, sit far too deep in defence, too much rolling the ball out to the centre halves, too much distance between the lines - all basic stuff to me that none of our opponents attempt to replicate.
As if the performance wasn't bad enough, the interest in George Forsyth is more concerning. He is by far our best player, physically and technically, and is our most creative passer of the ball. He's been utterly wasted at centre half, when his abilities and presence are needed in midfield. I certainly hope he stays.
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Post by alwaysnextyear on Nov 29, 2018 21:36:02 GMT
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