wh
Youth Teamer
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Post by wh on Nov 12, 2008 8:19:20 GMT
At last! some good news for WCFC www.worcesternews.co.uk/sport/wcfc/3838510.Cinderella_ground_targeted_as_City___s_new_home/I understand there is a rail stop planned just 100 yards away from the site and with the park and ride right on the sites doorstep its a no brainer! As Barry says in the piece we would already save £1.5M due to the infastructure already being in place. Let me reassure anyone who thinks this has been plucked out of the air in order to win votes that nothing could be further from the truth. This isnt a bunch of lies on a shareholders pack backed up by Johnny come lately's (or is that David come lately's) Barry Ward along with other shareholders and long surving supporters of WCFC have been gathering information for a number of months now regarding this and so far the feedback has been VERY positive from the authorities. The site is already designated as a sports arena on the local plan and is plenty large enough to house the proposed facilities.
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Post by richwidd on Nov 12, 2008 8:44:11 GMT
Above all else, it proves that there is (and are) an alternative(s) to Nunnery Way.
A two sided incomplete ground, no capital left, with the club almost certainly to be in debt by the time the first ball has been kicked.
Maybe the Board can now explain why they couldn't be sold on Barry Ward's credentials.
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Post by almasno9 on Nov 12, 2008 9:24:58 GMT
and we'd be eligible for the Welsh Cup again as that side of the river is technically Wales!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2008 9:45:21 GMT
There are far too many working class types that side of the river - will there be an enclosure for us toffs?
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Post by suv on Nov 12, 2008 12:56:58 GMT
At last! some good news for WCFC www.worcesternews.co.uk/sport/wcfc/3838510.Cinderella_ground_targeted_as_City___s_new_home/I understand there is a rail stop planned just 100 yards away from the site and with the park and ride right on the sites doorstep its a no brainer! As Barry says in the piece we would already save £1.5M due to the infastructure already being in place. Let me reassure anyone who thinks this has been plucked out of the air in order to win votes that nothing could be further from the truth. This isnt a bunch of lies on a shareholders pack backed up by Johnny come lately's (or is that David come lately's) Barry Ward along with other shareholders and long surving supporters of WCFC have been gathering information for a number of months now regarding this and so far the feedback has been VERY positive from the authorities. The site is already designated as a sports arena on the local plan and is plenty large enough to house the proposed facilities. ;D ;D The "puppet master" says ........... I'm begining to feel you're all the same, Dave Boddy is accused of being a "puppet" and having his "strings pulled", This is different? How?
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Post by dave on Nov 12, 2008 13:00:47 GMT
What park and ride? There are no plans at the moment for a rail stop either as far as I am aware?
The site is also in a residential area and any significant development is likely to attract a large amount of objections if a planning application was ever made. It is also the wrong side of the river from the motorway and the two railway stations in Worcester, so all in all a poor choice of venue for a new stadium in my view.
I am not sure a stadium is St Johns is a sensible alternative at all. It would have been far better for SAG to have come out in support of sharing facilities at Sixways than this.
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Post by gobby cow on Nov 12, 2008 13:11:40 GMT
I think it is an excellent idea. Nunnery Way is a no go, and as for Sixways that is total madness.
I must say I do think Barry needs to rethink that tie and shirt combination though!
It is the best news I have heard in ages - go SHAG group
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Post by dave on Nov 12, 2008 13:17:23 GMT
Gobby I am sorry but have you even got the first idea where the Cinderella ground is?
This is a terrible place to put the stadium for the following reasons...
1) It is nowhere near the Motorway and we all know how bad the traffic is from J7 across the Carrington Bridge and into St Johns!
2) It is in an existing residential area (houses are also about to be built on the old cinderella works site itself immediately adjacent to this site)
3) It is the other side of the river from Worcester's two railway stations.
I think this is a badly thought out knee jerk plan put in place so the SAG can say to shareholders that they have an alternative. Personally I think it could backfire on them as this looks as ill-conceived as the Nunnery Way scheme looks unaffordable!
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cogg
Squad Member
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Post by cogg on Nov 12, 2008 13:25:50 GMT
I'm not sure about this one
On one hand I have hugely fond memories of playing there in my Kays days ( and meeting a very young Croc. He got all the decisions wrong as always and even allowed several clearly offside golas to stand)
BUT
The traffic around the Southern 'by pass' is getting worse year on year, and any other way of getting to the ground just don't ( and probably won't ) exist.
I can walk there fom my in -laws though so who cares ;-)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2008 14:09:30 GMT
Why on earth does the football ground need to be near a motorway? But if this is an important criteria, then I don't think that 4 miles can be considered "nowhere near!" and we all know that the traffic on the Carrington Bridge is particularly bad during morning and evening rush hours, but the rest of the time it flows as well as any other busy road. Anyway its closer to a motorway than Hinckleys new ground, or Burtons new ground, or Eveshams new ground! Poor old Evesham, looked doomed to fail, building their community facilities so far away from a motorway AND a railway station!
It is adjacent to an existing residential area, a residential area which until not so long ago was blighted with one of the biggest warehouse eyesores known.
Its a very short taxi ride, or even bus ride from Foregate Street station, surprisingly its closer to a railway station than Nunnery Way is, and I don't think the river is going to form an impassable barrier! Being the "wrong side of the river" has never been a problem for Worcestershire Cricket Club, although being in the floodplain obviously has!
The idea has been very carefully thought out, in line with the councils initial plans for a football stadium. Remember Nunnery Way was considered a last resort due to its being in the Green Belt, on a site not favoured for development. The Nunnery Way site, and the whole existence of WCFC is based upon revenue from enabling development, which may yet again not get planning approval, and which according to st. modwen won't pay the way anyway!! This site has traditionally been a sports ground, there is historic value in maintaining this ground for sporting facilities. THe plight of the pavilion is well known, and it would be saved for the City of Worcester within this plan. Furthermore, unlike Nunnery Way, where there is nothing but lip-service being paid to "community" facilities, this scheme offers facilities for real community facilities, with alternative sporting facilities being developed on the site, such as the new swimming pool, archery facilities, bowling facilities and other potential. To think of this as a "knee-jerk" reaction is to undermine the many months of hard work done by people who actually care about the future of the football club. Do people think that this has just been plucked out of the air to add to the politicking?? This isn't the only alternative that SAG have considered, and there are other alternative solutions being considered, even Nunnery Way is considered as an alternative! Consideration for this scheme at Cinderella Ground has gone through proper due process, including initial costings (which are rather difficult without knowing the full scope of the financial mess at WCFC Ltd.), and consultations with the proper parties. No scheme is perfect, and there are issues obviously, however, this scheme has many attractions, not least the preservation of sporting facilities at this site dating back over 100 years. It is sad to see sporting facilities ripped up and replaced by housing, or industrial units, particularly those with such history. This will ensure good debate, which is good, and if nothing else, it proves that despite what the present Board have been saying, its not a case of Nunnery Way or bust, if you're prepared to do the hard work and find a solution. Next time Boddy or Alan Williams say "if we don't move to Nunnery Way, there will be no football club!" ask them about other alternatives, including a couple of their own which they've not mentioned publicly, probably to keep up this s*** or bust stance on Nunnery Way!!
SUV I have no idea what you're talking about, Barry is a shareholder working with a group of other shareholders who aren't prepared to just stand back and let the present Board lead us to failure without looking for other options. He's not pulling anyones strings, and no-one is pulling his. He has certain expertise which, although shunned by the present board, has been used successfully across the country by football clubs in dire trouble, his expertise has been used by Supporters Trust groups to guide them (I suggest the ST does a bit of homework on Barry, try contacting Supporters Direct and ask their opinion of his abilities?) He's spoken at various Supporters Direct events about the issues ST's face in running football clubs. Is this different? damn right it is - its eye-opening as opposed to the usual blinkered approach.
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Post by gobby cow on Nov 12, 2008 14:11:03 GMT
Dave I have no idea where the Cinderella ground is, I can only find my way around Worcester by handbag and shoe shops as Mr T will testify.
The Shag group must have researched it otherwise why would they even bring it up as a possible solution.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2008 14:36:28 GMT
Alison, its just up the road from the Kays warehouses on the Bransford Road, opposite the golf and country club (how do they manage to stay in business? surely on the wrong side of the river!) It is actually the Broughton Sports Ground, one of the first homes of Worcestershire County Cricket Club and has been used for sporting events since the !840's Cinderella Shoes was founded in Worcester around this time and it became known as the Cinderella Ground. It is where the late great WG Grace was first seen playing cricket in the Midlands. The 1870 pavilion was condemned in 2005, and has been under threat of demolision ever since. Like Cogg I played there a few times, and know many people who've enjoyed long hot summers playing cricket there. It is the scene of my biggest managerial triumph as a football manager, and for that reason alone it should be preserved!!! To suggest that this hasn't been researched, and more! is folly, after all, anyone could come up with an alternative off the top of their head - how about Plan C a ground a Sherriff Street Industrial Estate (nice and close to the railway station) or what about Plan D, looks good in my head - get rid of that noisy motocross track at Junction 6 of the M5 and put a stadium on there!! Now my knee is really getting jerky!
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Post by suv on Nov 12, 2008 14:47:10 GMT
SUV I have no idea what you're talking about, Barry is a shareholder working with a group of other shareholders who aren't prepared to just stand back and let the present Board lead us to failure without looking for other options. He's not pulling anyones strings, and no-one is pulling his. He has certain expertise which, although shunned by the present board, has been used successfully across the country by football clubs in dire trouble, his expertise has been used by Supporters Trust groups to guide them (I suggest the ST does a bit of homework on Barry, try contacting Supporters Direct and ask their opinion of his abilities?) He's spoken at various Supporters Direct events about the issues ST's face in running football clubs. Is this different? damn right it is - its eye-opening as opposed to the usual blinkered approach. The point I'm trying to make is "Boddy is accused of being a puppet and having his strings pulled by people behind the scenes, rather than these people speaking up for themselves". WH seems to have taken a similar role. For the record, Barry Ward has my vote (as recommended by Supporters Direct some months ago) One of nine votes "for" that I intend to use in the upcoming election
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Post by DazaB on Nov 12, 2008 14:47:41 GMT
3) It is the other side of the river from Worcester's two railway stations. Ohh, so that's why Rushden and Diamonds are in the s***! And as for the residents, can't we just park on their driveway and walk over the flowerbed? Seriously; What is a 6,000 capacity low-level stadium? How would this fit in with the deal with Careys? Does it rely on the deal with Careys being "not set in stone."? Also, A very foolish thing to do is to quote a date. "September 2012"...
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Post by DazaB on Nov 12, 2008 14:53:23 GMT
And what's this about a new railway stop?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2008 14:55:21 GMT
Agreed - quoting a date is dangerous.
A 6,000 low level stadium is lower than a 6,000 high level stadium - I imagine this means not two-tiered, or excessively high on one side like most stadiums tend to be - Bostons stadium is a low-level stadium.
If there's one certainty in life it is that no deal is set in stone!!
My personal preference for a stadium has always been Nunnery Way - which might surprise some people, but I mean a football stadium at Nunnery Way NOT dependant upon enabling development, as was the initial requirements for Nunnery Way. This plan is also not dependent upon enabling development, which means the football club will be run as a proper business fully accountable for its revenues - therein lies the problem with enabling development, I understand there's a £500,000 hole at Nunnery Way, because of the potential drop in yields from the enabling sites, what that has to do with football and running a stadium? nothing, but the market suffers, and the club can do nothing about it.
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wh
Youth Teamer
Posts: 44
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Post by wh on Nov 12, 2008 15:04:58 GMT
And what's this about a new railway stop? Barry told me to say "potential"
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Post by dave on Nov 12, 2008 15:28:40 GMT
Wayne, where is the park and ride you referred to?
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Post by dave on Nov 12, 2008 15:34:25 GMT
Jeremy, as someone "in the know" are the SAG still looking at Sixways as an alternative?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2008 16:02:56 GMT
Jeremy, as someone "in the know" are the SAG still looking at Sixways as an alternative? Only a fool would not consider alternatives - it still rancours with me that Dave Boddy played me like a fiddle on that one, telling me that of course there are othe alternatives to Nunnery Way, but they want to keep them out of the public eye - what a prat he made me look as I wrote about Plan B's and all the time there was none!!
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Post by creaner on Nov 12, 2008 17:10:22 GMT
Wayne, where is the park and ride you referred to? In the South Worcestershire Joint Core Strategy suggests: "Provide new integrated public transport services, e.g. Park and Ride, and improved bus + facilities and rail capacity." On their map there is one on the West side of the City.
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wh
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Post by wh on Nov 12, 2008 17:34:53 GMT
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Post by Tony is not to despondent now. on Nov 12, 2008 18:23:18 GMT
There are far too many working class types that side of the river - will there be an enclosure for us toffs? What do you mean "Working Class?" Anyway the toffs always sit in the main stand.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2008 18:31:05 GMT
Ealing, there's already an enclosure over there for you, its called Worcester Golf and Country Club - right up your street, or just over the road.
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si1268
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Post by si1268 on Nov 12, 2008 19:02:14 GMT
I think you might have to start thinking about plan C. That is staying put and not going bust. I can't see how anybody is going to buy the ground in the next 5 years for the sort of price required for WCFC to develope a stadium anywhere. Or maybe a ground share at sixways will appear on the agenda again?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2008 19:19:09 GMT
I'm just pleased that other options are being discussed at last - rather than just heading towards Nunnery Way without question. It might well be that Nunnery is the best option - although I doubt it, certainly not the way it's shaping up at the moment.
I like the sound of Worcester Golf and Country Club - do they sell scratchings?
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Post by tim on Nov 12, 2008 21:22:50 GMT
They do actually!
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Post by cityslicker01 on Nov 12, 2008 21:23:58 GMT
i think st johns is a good and the best route forward for worcester city
the proposed rail link 100 yards away and the fact that it is easily accessi ble from the city centre
the cinderella ground has already got the infastructure for this development and the cost would be reduced it really is for me a no brainer
good news at last woo hoo
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2008 21:39:36 GMT
I think you might have to start thinking about plan C. That is staying put and not going bust. I can't see how anybody is going to buy the ground in the next 5 years for the sort of price required for WCFC to develope a stadium anywhere. Or maybe a ground share at sixways will appear on the agenda again? As I said, there options for plan C and plan D, and most important in all of this is, How to survive at SGL, something the present Board seemed to forget about a few years ago. This will be made clearer in the letter to the shareholders.
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Post by gobby cow on Nov 12, 2008 22:18:01 GMT
No wonder Ihad no idea where it was. I havent been down that road for over 20 years!
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