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Post by thesecondjack on Jul 18, 2016 21:57:28 GMT
Time for City to fight for some silverware - the one that brings thousands through the turnstiles, yes, it's the Worcestershire Senior Cup!
Harriers played Stourbridge tonight and thanks to a late Jordan Murphy goal, are through to the semi final against Evesham on Thursday, meaning a rearranged fixture to be had for them against Stourport Swifts. Should Kiddy get through to the final of the cup, they will have two games played that day, the other being Doncaster at Aggborough (currently set for 3pm).
Would be nice for us to get one over on Redditch tomorrow, and meet Kiddy in the final, though I suspect we'd get a trialist/youth team XI in the final should both get that far, as they would surely want to field their strongest team against Donny when at home.
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Post by wcfcnb82 on Jul 18, 2016 23:31:32 GMT
And if we loose we are without a game Saturday then
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Post by alwaysnextyear on Jul 19, 2016 9:10:18 GMT
Yes, but I much prefer our pre season build up to Kiddy's, win or lose tonight. 4 or 5 games spread over 3 weeks has to be better than the same number in just this week alone !
Harriers played last night vs Stourbridge, they play tonight at home to Burton, on Thursday night away to Evesham, and on Saturday, they have Doncaster at home, and if they beat Evesham the WSC Final as well for 2 games on the same day. I've no idea how many trialists they're looking at, but one would have thought that barring one or two, their squad would be signed up by now.
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Post by thesecondjack on Jul 19, 2016 9:27:47 GMT
I think they had 5 trialists play last night. If you go Saturday to Saturday, they could potentially play 6 games in a week, plus a fixture against Stourport Swifts to probably squeeze in before the season starts too.
I'm sure we could find a team to play at short notice on Sat - Evesham might be willing to play us should they not progress.
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Post by alwaysnextyear on Jul 19, 2016 21:52:35 GMT
Based on what I saw tonight, it's going to be a long season. Redditch were the better side. We had little going forward, hardly any creativity or guile, the passing was sloppy, not much pace in the side, poor set piece delivery, too many passes sideways. Apart from that.....we also made Clayton McDonald look good !
I know it's only a friendly etc etc, but none of the trialists look better than what we've got, and where are the goals going to come from ?
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Post by thesecondjack on Jul 19, 2016 22:12:06 GMT
Long season indeed.
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dcx
Squad Member
Posts: 289
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Post by dcx on Jul 19, 2016 22:15:14 GMT
I know it's only a friendly etc etc, but none of the trialists look better than what we've got, and where are the goals going to come from ? I'd argue that every single keeper than has been on trial with looked better than what we have, cause what we have is an empty net! We have less than three weeks before the season starts and only 12 contracted players. We need a squad of 20 minimum. Are we really going to find 8 decent players in that time? I think we have found our level. A level below a team who are a division below who have lost all their best players.
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Post by thesecondjack on Jul 19, 2016 22:17:19 GMT
Heskey is still available on a free transfer.
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Post by miserablesod on Jul 19, 2016 22:24:11 GMT
Mbunga and Williams were AWFUL tonight.
Parodikromo, the lad with the long hair looked good though. I was definitely impressed with his contribution.
Jackman was poor tonight but Gater looked good.
Not sure on the keeper either.
Only one more game to get it right now...
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Post by crosscountrymark on Jul 20, 2016 0:28:28 GMT
It looks like the club is in a mess on and off the pitch, no new players since we signed Junior English around six weeks ago. We still have no goalkeeper, need a full back and no striker to score the goals, we cannot rely on a 40 year old and no wide players. We should of signed players who are tried and tested at this level or have the potential to step up, all we are looking at are players on trial who are not up to this level. This result tonight underlines the problems we have on the pitch, against a Reddich side who lost most of their best players when Liam Mcdonald left the club. It looks like its going to be a long season unless we can bring a number of players in who can make a difference to the squad. Starting a new ground share at Bromsgrove is a challenge and we need to get off to a good start, Harrogate will be a tough one followed by Tamworth away on their new 3G pitch.
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Post by cityontheup on Jul 20, 2016 6:35:53 GMT
Last night was awful most of the players we have had on trial have poor, it is as people have said going to be a long season. We have no striker in pre season why not give young Bates a go he scored a load of goals last season, I know it was in his age group but why not try him out. Waldron and Smith must be sat wondering what they have to do to get a game as they are better than those on trial.
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Post by alwaysnextyear on Jul 20, 2016 10:01:49 GMT
Last night, what worried me most, was that we just did not look like scoring, hardly creating a chance all game.
Don't worry about Bates, Smith and Waldron not playing. Carl knows what they can do, hence they are all contracted, so there was no need to play them last night. With only 13 players signed on ( and still no keeper ), Carl wanted and needed to see the trialists play. Sadly, none of the trialists have impressed me yet, so I just hope that Carl has a few more to look at.
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Post by Mark on Jul 20, 2016 11:44:00 GMT
I have not seen a pre season game but going purely on what is going on off the field plus the comments made here and in the paper I fear we could well be going down this season.
Sorry if you think I'm being overly pessimistic but that's just the way it appears at the moment.
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Post by thesecondjack on Jul 20, 2016 12:33:21 GMT
If we avoid relegation, Carl deserves the manager of the season award from the league.
My problem with the talk about having given players offers meanwhile watching the trialists, is that I don't understand why we couldn't have played a few of these players we've apparently offered contracts to as trialists!
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dcx
Squad Member
Posts: 289
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Post by dcx on Jul 20, 2016 12:43:39 GMT
If we avoid relegation, Carl deserves the manager of the season award from the league. My problem with the talk about having given players offers meanwhile watching the trialists, is that I don't understand why we couldn't have played a few of these players we've apparently offered contracts to as trialists! Probably because they have rejected our offers and don't want to sign for us/can find better elsewhere? What happened to James Chambers? Played one game, impressed, then decided not to come back? I also didn't understand why Brad Williams, the uninspiring winger who couldn't get in a Bath City side that almost went down last year, was stated ahead of this Partodikromo last night.
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Post by alwaysnextyear on Jul 20, 2016 13:00:14 GMT
I wouldn't think at this stage that anyone has rejected anything as yet, and offers are still on the table with some players.
Carl has to look at trialists who may also be playing trial matches elsewhere. Carl also has to start the game with some players one game, then bring them on as subs in another to see how they play and react. Now having looked at say, Brad Williams, in my opinion, he isn't any good. Presumably Carl assesses players along similar lines. There are a lot of surplus players about who no doubt are trying to play one club off against another before a flurry of signing on activity at the end of July. I've little doubt that Carl will sign up as many as he requires, and all we can do is trust in him to sign up the right players for us.
Playing loads of trialists isn't just confined to us. I think that Harriers have about 18 players signed on already, and are still giving trials to another 6 or 7.
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Post by jupu on Jul 20, 2016 13:22:03 GMT
Recent experience shows that in both 13/14 and 15/16 we didn't start off with the right players and Carl had to change things around very quickly in the early Autumn. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see another revolving door.
I think failure to secure a goalkeeper with less than three weeks until kick off must be a cause for concern although if I remember rightly neither José Veiga nor Nathan Vaughan were brought in until the season was upon us. We were fortunate to have them both and it seems to me than experience wins out over youth in this position.
Replacing the likes of Minihan, Thomas, Nti, Gudger can't be easy but other clubs seem to be able to do it. I guess it comes down to money in most instances.
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Post by inexile on Jul 20, 2016 18:59:29 GMT
We all know there is very little cash to bring in better players BUT why oh why are we trying to play extravagant formations with triallists. i was at stourport last night and it was clearly evident we had a lack of quality,on top of that we seemed to play with 3 centre backs,2 wing backs one sitting,then 2 and 2.i know that pre season is for trying these things but you could clearly see it wasn't working but our management did not change it? when you don't have the quality keep it simple and build a good atmosphere within the team (Leicester and Wales come to mind) and that more times than not will get you through a season unscathed. carl and kingy looked devoid of ideas last night and also very little instruction coming from the bench when the players most needed it.thats the most worrying thing for me. carl needs funds but he also needs to gel this team together very quickly otherwise it will be a terrible start and one hell of a fight to get out of.
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stamoo
First Teamer
Posts: 349
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Post by stamoo on Jul 20, 2016 21:08:01 GMT
I just reflect back on the pre-season this time last year. I was really excited having seen Minihan, Gudger, Morris and we had the 'marquee' signings of Campion and Rowe I really thought we had a shot at the 'play offs'. As we know it didn't work out and in the end we did well to stay in the division.
This time, having lost Minihan, Gudger, Thomas, Nti I share the lack of optimism that others have expressed. But just like last season I hope I am wrong again and that this season we exceed expectations. Based on past experience I do trust Carl to get the best from what we have - we can ask no more of him. Fasten your seat belt and cross your fingers. Last year I was hoping for the play offs; this season I WILL be overjoyed if we retain our status.
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Post by adycrean on Jul 21, 2016 5:41:21 GMT
Carl seems to be laying the blame for poor recruitment this season at the door of the off the field troubles.....
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Post by Mark on Jul 21, 2016 6:01:41 GMT
Don't worry, Mr Hampson has predicted a vibrant (or some such term) future for the club
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Post by cloud on Jul 21, 2016 7:43:08 GMT
Carl seems to be laying the blame for poor recruitment this season at the door of the off the field troubles..... The off field troubles will only be resolved if we either fold, or move to a new ground back in Worcester. It's something that will hang over the club for the foreseeable future, Carl, the players, fans - everyone. Any on field troubles (not good enough players etc) are small by comparison. Even if we were relegated it wouldn't really make any difference (as it stands, grants are a million miles away). The only downside to being relegated is that all the money we've spent maintaining status in a league we can't afford to play in (in the hope of getting a grant) - would all have been wasted.
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dcx
Squad Member
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Post by dcx on Jul 21, 2016 17:07:49 GMT
I wouldn't think at this stage that anyone has rejected anything as yet, and offers are still on the table with some players. Unfortunately it turns out I was bang on,, as Carl has stated he has "lost count" of the amount of players that have turned us down, citing off field reasons. I don't think giving those sorts of interviews which are then published in the local press is really doing our recruitment power any good, although I understand his frustration. My concern at this stage is who is left to take? Yes there are the likes of Sean Clancy still floating around, but realistically the best players from lower leagues (an area that has yielded some good hidden gems previously, and our best shot at getting some decent players that aren't budget breakers) have already been signed on. Look how how early we moved for Gudger last season. Ian King has done nothing as far as I can see with his 'vast connections' other than bring two trialists over, a midget goalkeeper who played one half and an awful winger. I don't doubt they are trying, but it's really f**k**g depressing.
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Post by adycrean on Jul 21, 2016 18:39:26 GMT
I wouldn't think at this stage that anyone has rejected anything as yet, and offers are still on the table with some players. Unfortunately it turns out I was bang on,, as Carl has stated he has "lost count" of the amount of players that have turned us down, citing off field reasons. I don't think giving those sorts of interviews which are then published in the local press is really doing our recruitment power any good, although I understand his frustration. My concern at this stage is who is left to take? Yes there are the likes of Sean Clancy still floating around, but realistically the best players from lower leagues (an area that has yielded some good hidden gems previously, and our best shot at getting some decent players that aren't budget breakers) have already been signed on. Look how how early we moved for Gudger last season. Ian King has done nothing as far as I can see with his 'vast connections' other than bring two trialists over, a midget goalkeeper who played one half and an awful winger. I don't doubt they are trying, but it's really f**k**g depressing. I agree. It must be hard to excite and recruit players at the moment. But surely it is about conveying some sense of excitement and opportunity on the playing side - whether it is a good team spirit / environment, an opportunity to prove people wrong, playing on our recent good cup pedigree etc.. Talking things down will not help.
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Post by cloud on Jul 22, 2016 8:41:53 GMT
It would have been so much different, had the vote to change to a community club been a success. The future would look so much brighter. We all heard what Carl had to say before the vote, when he was on the Board. The situation we have now is because of the way the vote went.
We now just wait to see what the olive branch between the club & the trust is, to see if there's a way forward.
I think we'll be using the first few months of the season to try out players, like we've done for the last few years.
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Post by crosscountrymark on Jul 22, 2016 10:18:09 GMT
I cannot believe how negative our manager is with his comments to the Worcester news, the one thing you do is deal with the problems in the dressing room not air you views to the world to hear. We all know its going to be a big struggle this season with the league so competitive, and the part squad assembled so far will struggle in a league two league below us. How we get a squad together before season is going to be a challenge with most players already signed up and into pre season, so it only leaves players on trial or loan deals from league clubs. We seem to lost all our contacts with league clubs or any scouting for players with any potential like from Loughborough. We trust Carl and his staff will get it right before the season starts against Harrogate Town.
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Post by Brooksiders Return!! on Jul 22, 2016 10:36:19 GMT
Its a sad situation, the off the field issues havent suddenly appeared, they've been there for years, so this idea that players don't want to come to City due to this is slightly disingenuous. And City aren't the only club with issues, most clubs in and around our league are suffering similar revenue generation issues. A few years back when Graham Turner was manager, and owner, at Hereford United, he had winding up petitions being thrown at the club, the FA placed a transfer embargo on the club, they were in turmoil. Turner started a pre-season with just six players, but built a team of freebies with a fair few local lads and challenged for the Conference play-offs. Still using freebies he even got promotion back to the Football League. He still couldn't buy players in the League, but through loans and freebies he got them promoted to League One. All this was done with players fully aware that the club was in dire financial straits, and with minimum fuss from Turner. If players are so fickle that they don't want to play football at non-league level for a club unless its financially stable, then I'd suggest that they are not the kind of player who plays for the badge.
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Post by alwaysnextyear on Jul 22, 2016 13:34:23 GMT
Totally correct Jem. Our problems have been around for years, and I just don't believe that players are that fickle regarding the situation at the Club. Sure, it doesn't help, but how many players stay longer than 2 to 3 years anyway ?
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Post by thesecondjack on Jul 22, 2016 13:37:36 GMT
I can see why people are annoyed with Carls comments, but what do they expect him to say? Do you want him to be going to the press and saying ''we will be pushing for the playoffs this season''? We all know a successful season will end with WCFC 19th in the league - if he sells the club to good conf north players thinking we will do well, but after 4-5 games we look like we're relegation candidates, they're going to be wanting moves away from the club.
Carl needs to try and find a few gems in the lower leagues who are looking to prove themselves on a bigger stage. He needs to sell the progression that Williams, Nti, Nelson-Addy, Murphy, Minihan, Gudger etc, who have all had their game improved and gone on to (arguably) bigger clubs partly thanks to WCFC. This of course is easier said than done.
As for the off the pitch issues causing on the pitch issues (as I highlighted a couple of weeks ago) - Most clubs are in tough financial situations, but if you read through their local papers, it's not all doom and gloom - with ours, it certainly is. I fully understand why, and think some of the issues pointed out to/by the press were necessary for the future of the club, but it certainly is an excuse for Carl in my opinion. Catch 22 I suppose - Don't mention the struggles the club is in, the club will fold. Mention them, and the club struggles to gain personnel good enough to compete. Doomed or doomed.
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Post by Brooksiders Return!! on Jul 22, 2016 16:38:26 GMT
Best say nothing at all! The Hereford United story was all over the Hereford Times from 2000-2003, any player reading the press would have known the situation. I don't think that the financial situation around the club is Carls real concern, after all, the club isn't going under this year, or next. And all that the Supporters Trust are doing is presenting a framework for a sustainable long term for the club, when this seasons players will have long moved on. This is more about sustainable constitution change, not a rescue plan to bring the club back from the brink. Remember it was the Chairman who said that the club only had 2/3 years left! I think Carls problem is that other clubs locally are able to splash the cash upfront, regardless of their financial position. If you read Redditch Uniteds accounts, they're not that pretty a picture either, but Chris Swan is doing two things, he's bringing in investors and he's selling a vision. And I agree, the vision at WCFC should be sold as a springboard club, that should be a value proposition for players to buy into. As we say "you sell the sizzle, not the sausage" When I worked at Informix, we never sold the company on the facts that the CEO had been jailed for corporate misgovernance and overstating earnings, which cost shareholders billions of dollars, we sold the most advance internet ready databases in the World! And companies spent billions of dollars on them! And lets face it, this is non-league football, there are plenty of players waiting to see if they are going to be put on contract, and there will be plenty who don't get a club come the end of July or early August, they'll want to be playing somewhere, and won't be accessing Companies House prior to getting their wedge. Also, there will be players released early in the season when its not quite working out a la Rowe and Campion at City. They need to find a home somewhere. In the really dark days when the club had 48 hours to avoid winding up petitions , players still arrived, and departed as per usual.
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